Hello everybody and welcome to the RDM podcast. I'm yours truly Rabbi Daniel Malinga. Today
is a unique day. I'm hosting two people that inspire me, a gentleman and a lady. I'll start
by introducing the lady, Josephine Omunide, who is a woman of very many hearts. But before
we go into that, Josephine, you're very welcome. Thank you. And I do appreciate that you pronounced
my name. Just one percent of the people who pronounce the Omunide name right. Thank you.
All right. And on my right is a broadcaster, a gentleman also wearing multiple hats. And that's
the reason why both of you are here. Keita Anguzu, you're very welcome, sir. You nailed it too.
Thank you. I'm very good at pronouncing it. Yes, it's Anguzu. Most people try to, aha,
which is wrong. So you end up with Anguzu. You have to end up up in the north. Okay. Yes,
I'm so happy to be here. You're welcome, sir. And of course, Michael Host Afimani,
Manny Baggs McLean. You're very welcome, sir. Thank you. Good to be here as always. All right.
We're going to dive deep into the conversation because we have a lot to touch. You are two
different people, but with multiple skills, you started from somewhere and the Lord has brought
you to a particular point in time. And I feel like your stories can inspire a number of people
who are listening. So I guess our ladies will be faster. And then the gentleman will follow.
The owner. Josephine, you're a person, like we said, who has taken on many hats along the
role of your life. Tell us how your journey began briefly and how far the Lord has brought you.
Whoa. I don't even want to look at how far the Lord has brought me, but again,
how far this the Lord is going to take me. From a village grown up in ginger, in a very
extended family, struggled, struggled my way through, but my eye was always on the fact that
life has to be made. Note, I have to make it. Life has to be made. And having kicked off as
a teacher in school, I just jammed to take that direction and I had wanted to be on TV,
to do broadcasting. My mother says I always sat in her dressing mirror and mimicked the late ballet
Francis. So I got into Kampala for the first time while coming to Chamburgot. And immediately
that was done. I looked for Uganda Film and Television Institute then, which did propel me to get
internship into UBC at that point in time. And I was like, no, this is not my kind of
WBS was crim dollar crim then. I found my way in there as a presenter, found my way into being
head of productions, head of features, and finally head of news. No sooner had I settled than
Africa Broadcasting launched into Uganda. And when it came out, that was the brand
that it moves with NTV currently. I was part of the five people that it took out of a WBS.
And we started off at NTV. But even then, I had just returned from one of my
long awaited scholarships in the United Nation, United States of America. I had had
a moment at Howard Broadcasting. That's Howard TV. I had been at CNN in Atlanta. I had been at
PBS. PBS is the UBC of the USA. And when I got into NTV for the first two months, I was like,
no, this is not my kind of thing. But while I returned from that scholarship, I had met a mogul
who was coming into the country to buy off the National Insurance Compression. And he said,
I need you. You're going to kick off as our communication person. You're really good.
And that's how I got into corporate communications out of broadcasting. But it is something that
I still love as a passion. And to date, I do films, productions with them. Well, for passing time,
I finance them, get to do them and get going. It just never settles for me to stay into
one place. One place. I got bored. Okay. Okay. That's a good introduction.
Kater, your story briefly. I'm quite old, so it's a long story. But in short,
I grew up, I can't say it was a religious family, but we're very talkative people.
So that fits the Bill of Casta, right? One of my earliest memories or in life
is my father returning home every evening to listen to the BBC World Service.
Puts his small radio by table, sits on the train the evening and listening to Robin White
and Elizabeth Ohini and Charles Taylor is a rebel. And you know, the news today,
he's been arrested, Sergeant Doe murdered, and you know, and you'd see him shaking his head.
And you know, so he must into the news. And the thought that went through my mind at one day was
how powerful radio is. So I grew up with a passion for radio.
Well, as a tool, but communication is my thing. Because I thought, look at my hero, how he is
hypnotized, how he's into, you know, held by someone who is thousands of miles away.
So I thought how nice it would be to be that person who can hook people. And so I started out
as a, as an ignorant minister, as an evangelist preaching the Gospel on palpites that I created.
Why do I say that? When I knew from a young, from my young days that I was called to minister,
to be a minister, that I knew. So communication was my thing. Even before I was born again,
I read a lot of my Bible. And my dad used to say, man, you run mad because people who read a lot
of their Bible run mad, which is not true. But so, so when I got born again, it gave me purpose.
So I desired to communicate the truth of the Word of God. And so I went out first to schools,
because nobody wanted to go to schools. Everyone wanted to go to a church and a conference and a
big mega church. So naturally I jumped into secondary schools, just because I remembered again
being a student, almost every preacher that came to school was boring, man. And as a teenager, I
thought, no, the Gospel can be preached better, can be communicated better. So when I went to school,
and I'm glad you were, you saw me in action. From S1. I say, say, say, taking no prisoners.
1999. I took no prisoners, guys. I shot them on site. You give me five minutes. One of the
things that we trained our teams, I trained my team was to communicate the Gospel in seven minutes,
the seven minute sermon. Introduce yourself, introduce the topic, preach the Word, make an
altar call, do a closing prayer in seven minutes. So that means the sermon is on what three? Okay.
Read a scripture, explain it, and ask for a response. And so that was my, that was my clip,
your short films, so to speak. So that was my target. And so we would go to a school, preach
the Gospel, get people saved, filled with the Holy Spirit, and pray for the sick, for the miraculous,
and go away. And schools lunchtime, how much time do they have for service? It's lunchtime,
which is one hour, but by the time they leave, it's 10 minutes. They come into the service,
organize themselves, 20 minutes gone. The service starts at half past. Some people first eat,
so they come in at 45. So they don't have much time. They will do praise and worship for what,
15 minutes. So the sermon is seven minutes. And so for 18 straight years, that's what I did with
my entire life. I didn't start out with the end in mind. All I knew is I needed to do something.
So I went to these places. And guess what? What title did I have? None, because everywhere you
went, they said, so you're a pastor, and you're like, no, no, no. I mean, evangelist. Yes. I just
said brother. Oh, you know why? I remember. Yes. Yes. Okay. Because that is the one title
that nobody had a scramble on. Yeah. Because I mean, if you said, yeah, brother, you've come to
share the one. You get that from Kenneth Hagan, right? Ah, yes. Him and
and Ramah Bible College, the gentleman is Kenneth Hagan and yes, Kenneth Copeland. Okay. Yeah.
Brother, you know, because you never fall in trouble. But because the moment you said pastor,
they said, which church did you pastor? Apostle, which one did you plant? Prophet? How many prophecies?
I didn't like, man, too much pressure. Brother Cator, I am just here to share that one. Yeah.
And I mean, I will tell you stories for the next three days where we are thrown out, where we will
come, where, you know, they would think what good can come out of these two small boys and you'd show
up and God was always faithful. The miracle should show up. People would weep. People would get saved.
Muslims would get saved. You know, stuff would happen and people would be like,
can you come back tomorrow? You were like, of course. And so 18 years I did that. And then I
transitioned later into radio purely again, as if by mistake. One of my disciples through
school's ministry one day, you know, after two, three years, I've not seen him. So I bump into
him and they say, dude, where have you been? He's like, oh, well, you see, you taught us to go to
school. So I moved my parents moved to, you know, Boyo Gerere. And so I no longer moved to that
town church. So now I went there, told my pastor, I want to go to schools. So all the schools in
eastern, I preach there every week. I have a team of over 40 people. And we bring together over a
thousand, you know, students from different schools every Wednesday night to church, we minister to
them, we get them safe, feel the Holy Spirit. I'm like, dude, you're doing very well. So he says,
however, a friend of mine, you know, asked me, so we're just talking. And then I said,
and then he says, Oh, I do something on radio. You know, once in a while, I go help them out.
So I said, one day I would want to do something with radio. And then he stops and said,
are you serious? I'm like, yeah. And then he says, I can walk you up with the manager.
The meeting happened in two weeks time. Long story short, I was hired. I thought it was in
interview, but they were telling me so. So how are you going to run the show? And I'm thinking,
halfway, I'm like hired. And that is another what 18 years ago, on the 13th of February, 2005.
Okay. So since then, you have gone into broadcasting. Yes. But I noticed about both of you.
Okay. So, so, and then I'm going to bring in McLean. Josephine
worked in the corporate world. Specifically, we mentioned the UN. You've also started an NGO,
which is a very key factor in what we're going to discuss today. Engenda girls mentorship, is it?
Then you've also gone into filmmaking. All right. You said you do it casually, but
some people, it's their purpose and they haven't started what you're doing casually.
Others haven't yet begun. Okay. Then we have Keita, brother Keita.
Oh, that's my favorite. Okay. So you started, I knew you as an evangelist from back those days.
Then you're a businessman. Okay. You have some other businesses on the side.
Then you started out in Spirit FM as a broadcaster, a presenter. Right. And then you went into ownership.
Right. Co-owning Spirit FM. What a journey. And before I bring you, I asked the question I had
asked. I'm going to ask McLean to first shoot what's on his heart. And then I'll ask that question.
For me, it's just interesting. It's interesting because we have the right people in the studio.
You know, all I'm hearing is just communication. And I'm hearing dreams. I'm hearing visions. And
it's not just one thing. It's a number of things. And you can feel the hunger from the introductions
already. You understand? So for me, I'm interested in, let's dig deeper. Let's find out more and
let's explore the discussion. Okay. So how did you break beyond the limitations of what people
thought or personally what you might have thought? This is me. This is what I can do.
How did you get the courage to wear the different hats that both of you wear?
I'll start with you, Josephine. I believe it goes back to the inner
pursuit within me, which I believe bathed by the spirit to dare grating.
Daring greatly just kept pushing me to the next level of wanting more of God and all that. You've
talked about my associational working in the corporate world. I did drift off into the development
world, the cooperative league of net assets of America. Did a BI trust? Did the European Union
where I was overseeing about six organizations under the European Union emergency trust fund?
And these are really serious organizations like sub the children, Belgium Development Agency,
Danish Refugee Council, ZOA, among others. But I thought I was doing it right, doing it so well
as a communication person, really enjoying it. Until one day I went onto my knees and I'm like,
God, is this really what you want me to do? And yeah, one he did communicate. But being me and
I'm like, Ned, I was enjoying my stuff. So I just kept going. But something came back and like here
to go back double check. And indeed that was towards first September 2019 when I was like,
okay, good for real. What's here? A week thereafter, a trance hit me as I drove home
and there was signage engender girls. The previous year I had been featured as part of Uganda
Stop 40 under 40. And I had talked about the need for me to just mentor girls. The word engender
came up as we were having this interview. It was featured. It is there. Beyond the trance, I drove
to a friend's home who happens to be my friend. And while there, she's like, but Josephine, you
need to take care of the girls, you know, take care of the girls, blah, blah, blah, blah. Following
there was a Saturday, a former boss of mine while I was working with the Embassy of the Kingdom of
Netherland. Organizations was in the country to finish her doctorate. And her name is Astrid. She
told me, Josephine, I'm in the country. I need to have lunch with you tomorrow. Something very
important to note. She's an atheist. We had lunch at Café Sari and she's like, Josephine,
among everything else you're doing after we have spoken, she's like, you actually need to
reach the girl. You need to, as in she literally covered up everything and see how God is using
these different people to tell me just the same message. I launched out the following month. I
had to do a round documentation across the country of the projects, documentaries,
accessories. I had a team of people. By the time we did the trip, Kampala, Western Uganda back,
Northern Uganda back, I had the logo ready. I had the vision ready. I had literally what I needed
to touch me of. So it was about daring greatly, choosing to listen to the spirit that is actually
speaking to you, vis-à-vis what it is that my comfort zone is and I'm swimming in there.
Wow. What about you, Gaita? Because she seems to be the person once. You know she hits it on the
nail. Kindred spirit. You guys were in the spirit on the Lord's Day to ask both of us to come.
Because a lot of times I jump into things from my heart before I figure out the fullness of it.
And then I realized that all along I was in the right place. That all along the Lord actually had
ordered these steps. So your question is how then do you move from say what we've always known to
transition. It's from conversations like that. I told you this gentleman says, yeah, you mean,
yeah, yeah. And I said it out of my long held desire. Just like I want to do something with
radio. I would love to be. Those were the exact words. I would like one day to do something with
radio. He's like, oh, like what? I'm like, I don't know. And then he says, I can hook you up.
Set up the meeting on a, that was say on a Saturday. That meeting was on a Thursday. Saturday I was at
work. Sunday. Sunday was, it was a Sunday. Sunday I was at work. But even then surely you couldn't
have thought to yourself that you would end up owning the company that you. No, no. At that point,
all you want to do is you give it your all. You give it your best. I am a very intense person.
If I am going to be involved in something, count me in a hundred percent if it is for free.
Remember, we did all these youth ministries and missions without a budget, without a plan. The
plan was in our hearts. And we discovered it as we went. One of my best scriptures,
two of my best scriptures about that vision and getting stuff done is the followers,
the whole testament. And they, they, they just said, if we sit here, we'll die. If we go in the
city, they might still kill us. But at least let's get killed while we're trying to get a solution.
I mean, why do we sit here? And then our fate is sealed anyway. We lose nothing by trying.
My wife and I usually say, try it. No one will send you a bill for it.
Try it. If it fails, what's the worst? The worst is that it will fail. But again,
I have an ego big enough to fail. No. I mean, listen, it's my life. I owe it to nobody except God.
And so, and only God can help me beyond human. So if I fail, it's all right. I'll just tell God,
oh, sorry, didn't work out. But again, we have a spirit of faith in us that keeps pushing you. So
out of that conversation, it's 18 years later, many things change and, you know,
shareholding opportunities come up and people are watching. Never underestimate that God and God
systems can never get cheated. Even human systems, a hardworking person, give them time. They will
buy you out. And the Bible says find a man who is diligent. Yes, he will not stand before my men
useless, useless things. So that means when you're working there, you really are serving the Lord
Christ, like the scripture says. So you're not just watching five o'clock, four, four fifty nine. I
didn't leave four fifty nine. I didn't come to work just when I was needed. I did things that I was
not asked to do. I just realized they are clients who come in and they are not attended to. The
innovations they came up with that were beyond my duty. And so, and guess what? The system begins
to reward you. And if I can just quickly tell you, I started out on a volunteer facilitation of
120,000 shillings. If you factor in inflation, what's that now? Maybe 40,000.
I mean, 18 years later, maybe that's 40k. I'm sorry, let's just talk about because I
skicked off with a 350k. But you guys, factor in inflation, what's that now?
It should be like 100k. Maybe 100k. Wasn't a lot of money, but for me, it was not the money.
Like, you know how the CEOs, they're trying to figure out the numbers. I'm thinking,
just let's talk about the work. But then again, you respect the money enough to listen.
So long story short, in about two years after I joined, the manager, the company was going
through a lot of stuff. And so, one day I hear that they were sacked. And so, in the night,
one of my friends calls me, a manager, and says, the CEO wants to meet you.
I got scared because money had been blah, blah, blah, things. I'm like, oh my God.
Do these guys think I have anything to do with it? I had a sleepless night. I was worried.
I agreed to a lunch at Web City Cafe around Nita Cinema. I can't forget. I came,
like, really trembling. I'm thinking, this guy somehow thinks I have anything to do with this.
I had rumors the whole week. And so, I sit there, stiff, and lunch is served. Honestly,
I didn't even touch the food. So guys, you know, you know how CEO talk is. It's big stuff, easy
light. How are you doing, man? So how's your mother? Where are you born? So what did you study?
And you know, and he hadn't noticed that I was around anyway. He would come around for, what,
three, four days, go away for three months, come around for a week, go around, away for six months.
But then someone told him, because that place was vacant. And so he said,
there's a young man you need to meet. There's a young man. So he calls me and he says,
so he tells me, so you know, so and so, you know, these many things happen. So I had to do a clean
sweep. And I'm listening worried, like, I'm waiting for that connection. What do I have to do with
this? And then he says, are you interested in the job? Completely caught off guard. And me being me,
I'm like, I quickly answered, I said, let me pray about it. That's the Christian thing to do when
you want to buy time, right? So I'm going to pray about it. I mean, he's a Christian, so he's thinking,
yeah, yeah, yeah, pray, but listen, I think this is of God, because I feel in my heart, I mean,
I'm just meeting you, but I was just told about yesterday. So you need to think about it. I live
tomorrow. So let's agree quickly. So in the night, I said, so I said, let's meet tomorrow. And the
next day he begins texting me work. So go to this place and go to UCC, get this God, I'm thinking,
okay, so dude, I said, I'll get back to you. But he's already sending me work. But me being me,
I still out of respect. And I still go around those errands. And we didn't have that meeting
until a year later. So from what I'm getting from both of you guys, and Maki, you're going to come
in, is is destiny help has played a very vital role in pushing you towards your purpose.
Okay, right. Yeah, this may help us. But again, I like picking up from from the discussions,
because really, our interest is your stories, because we're hoping that it will inspire someone
else who's watching, you know, and from what you were sharing and where you chipped in what I picked
up was the beat of your perception towards what people would consider failure. Okay, because failure
is not defeat. You understand failure does not mean closure does not mean the end of the story.
It's a learning process. It's part of the learning process. It's just like how yes and no are answers.
It's just the question of how you choose to look at the know. So if you look at no as a closed door,
then that is that's that's what it is. But if you look at it as an option to knock at another door
or to knock again, then there's an opportunity in there. You know, so why I'm saying that is because
that kind of mindset, combined with your attitude towards doing whatever you're doing,
going all out, even find beyond what you were asked to do is literally what vision does.
It pushes you beyond your like, you don't have to be paid to do it, you just feel it,
you know, you have to do it. I could actually I could actually have paid them to do work,
you know, like to just just allow me to to show you what I can do, not really to show you as much
as give me the opportunity. So for me, Spirit FM gave me the opportunity to just experiment
things and do things. Oh, did I tell you that? So he's driving to the airport. And then he says,
so I've given you all this work at the end of the month will give you, you know, some money.
I don't know how much you earn, but you will have some 400 500,000. That's how you put my text. And
we all my deals for the like three, four years when SMS. So I'll go to HR for money. And they're
like, we don't know. And then so I'll just get out and SMS. I mean, fun it is, because it was
almost that casual, but I liked it because my personality was that I kept running and running
and running. And then so when he texts that, I go ahead and do it. And for me, the money is the
last thing it is a facilitation to do what I want to do. And then he says, and then and then so he
gives me all this work. And then I go like, now I think he could sense the timidity, the fear,
the questions questioning myself. I mean, he is a 50 plus gentleman talking to a 25,
26 year old young man, you can sense the fears. And then he says, man, don't fear, you can do this.
And then he says, you know, until he passed on, I didn't know, I never got to ask him whether
he said the next statement, I'm going to tell you, just to inspire me. Or it was a trick.
So he tells me, don't fear to do this thing. All good managers, 60% of the time they are wrong.
So never fear to make a bad decision. Okay, I mean, it's your company, it's your money. So if I
mess up, the boss has said, do not fear to make a decision. 60% of good managers are wrong. 60%
of the time, they go like, bring it on. And so you enter a place, you make a bad decision,
as long as you own up for us, our culture was go fail, come and then tell us how we can improve it.
So we were a failure, accepting, you know, we tolerated like, yeah, yeah, now you know it,
that won't work. So there's, there's a way you meet challenges. But I'm curious to hear from
Josephine, as a woman inside a corporate world,
surely the challenges that you're faced, you know, I always meet a lot of young ladies who tell me
that, you know, even when a lady works her way, and is good at something, someone will always
conclude that someone helped her or, you know, not even just helping, they are ad libs to that.
When you're such a beautiful girl, it is literally a stampede. I like what McLean
brought out in terms of a failure. And the way Kato, you know, just, I just felt like
shooting further questions, you know, I reserve that and I believe I'll coffee up to just hear
so much more. Very inspirational. Failure comes at a point in time to give you an opportunity,
to either go up or go down. So is it a point where you're going to pick your glass half full
and stay there? I mean, go up or half empty and just stay down. One of my biggest failures in
life happened at about that time. And Rabbi knows this very well. That failure came with
loss of esteem. It really hit me so hard that it brought me even way closer to God.
I just dug deep in there for the first time in my life, I lost a job where a contract was not
renewed saying something is not right about Josephine, take time off. And that's the point where
I created, no, I literally turned my bathroom into a wall. And in there, I just got to speak here,
God, I thought I was hearing, but I really got to hear. And so many answers came from that.
And in gender, all integration of responses and what God was doing,
destiny helping and all that came to play. In the corporate world, while yes, I couldn't
leave work just any time, I remember just one scenario when, oh my God, one of these Nigerian
bosses thought that Josephine, in how she does things, needs to be with me at Kampala Casino
to be able to get some client. And in my head, I was like, sorry, I can't. That earned me
a suspension. Then when I earned it, I was like, I'm resigning. A week later, the board meeting
was actually taking place and Josephine was nowhere. The board was able to see that Josephine is
nowhere. And they asked, I remember I was doing my masters, the other masters that I did in
Makere. And while I was reading for the exam, the phone call came in and I was told, we need you here.
In my genes, I got into the board room. And if I could say anything the chairperson said,
and we are talking about serious board members here, the likes of Dr. Martin and Kay, oh my God,
they were all in there. And like Josephine, they were directing the MD.
Josephine, give Josephine back her job. How much were you earning? I was all blushing,
I couldn't say. She said double the salary. She missed a, please get, for me, it gave me
confidence. At that point, I was an assistant manager. So it became corporate communication
manager. But going back to the failure, I sought God. The answers came easily. At that point,
what you talked about, they will say somebody helped them. Here they would say, no, she slept with
somebody. Yeah, of course. That's, that's unfortunately, that's what's best. But we struggle as women in
that world, well, the patriarchal environment, to just put our feet together, you know, and say,
I can do this, or even show for it. I did believe I showed for it, but it was still a big struggle.
Female future program, one that I happened to be part of, was a big inspiration. I got to learn
about what's happening in the setting of the boardrooms in the world, mainly pushing women leaders
there. Based on everything that I was struggling with at that point, and all that the Lord was
bringing, I'm like, here we are, in gender girls' mentorship is actually going to nurture the girl
from seven years to become the next generation of woman thought leader. Early enough. And I'll tell
Rabbi McLean, the numbers that keep coming up, the girls jump out, and they're already winning
speakership of their school. They are this perfect, and we are doing an impact assessment
in that regard. So that's, that's interesting. Yes. I love, I love this lady's story. You know,
I've read a CV, it's quite, honestly, at some point, when I was reading it at some point, I said,
okay, you know what? Yes. Let's, let's just move on. Let's, let's look at the agenda. But I love
what you're doing with the agenda. I really love it, because I feel everybody, every human being
deserves the right to, to speak up. You understand? And all of us have different giftings, all of us
have different calls and different anointings, and we can only reach the climax of things if we
all come together. You understand? And so there is no need for the man to be the one who is saying
what he has to say, when a lady can say it even better, or can help him say it better. You understand?
So I love what you're doing with the, with the, with the ladies. You know? So just continuing
from what I was bringing out, because you had asked the question about destiny helpers, and I was
still trying to drive the point there. It was for me, the bit of, because of your passions,
because of how you sold out your passion, you go out of your way to do things that you're not even
paid to do. You understand? It's those things, it's those characters, those attributes that draw
the attention of people, because that's what vision does. It will draw people to you. You don't go
looking for, for the people. And so I think for the two of you, that's how the opportunities ended
up showing up. You know, I have, I have the same, I have a similar story as well. I was walking,
I'm in security consultancy. Unfortunately, because of work, I'm, you know, some of the information
I can disclose as much, but all I can say is I was somewhere in a camp, far away from the main
office where the CEOs cannot actually see your work. It's like you're, and nobody, you understand?
You show up in the city center just once a week, and then you disappear for another whole month,
or three months, and then you show up again. But I was surprised after the one year, you know,
gig that we're doing, I got a call, just like you, on a Saturday morning, to show up at work,
and have a meeting with the MD. And when I came in, I had no idea what the discussion was about,
because we had just finished handing over the project on a Friday, Saturday morning, I get this
call, I show up in the boardroom, and then we're having this discussion, long story short, by the
time it comes to the close, all it tells me is we've been noticing you. We've been paying attention,
and I'm thinking from where? I only show up here once, you understand? But whatever I was doing
was preceding me, and I had no idea about this, you understand? So at the end of the day, as I was
leaving the boardroom, what happened was a new office, that didn't exist, a new position, that
didn't exist, was created to accommodate me. Ever since then, it was just from this to that to that,
to the point where now I'm a COO. So for me, I pick that, and I can relate to the stories that
you're sharing, because it resonates with what vision actually is, and that's the gist of what
we wanted to discuss here today, you understand? So if you guys could just, and I'll start with
Kater, if you could just continue on that trajectory that you are on, on some of the attributes,
you understand? That sold you to your vision, and that helped you to build the empire that you're
building now, you know? I think that would help a number of people. I'm glad you asked. There are
things, you took me on that journey, mentally I was watching a boardroom, you know? I don't know,
I listen in 3D or 5D. With mental pictures. Yes, I do pictures, I picture that guy shaking your
hand, sitting there turning, you know, and all that kind of stuff. And so, you see, vision is divine.
It's something that God infuses into you that you can't help. Now, it is up to you to be faithful
to it or not, or to ignore it. That's why Paul said, when I first was called as an apostle,
I didn't first go to Jerusalem to confer with those who were apostles before me,
but rather I was, I went into the desert of Arabia for three years, and from where I received my
gospel. Listen to this guy, big braggadocious as if. My gospel. And then in another place,
when he explained, he said, Jesus, according to my gospel, in other words, this is my thesis.
He said, I did not first confer, you know, with those who were apostles before me, I don't preach
after hearing the rest of you. No, I speak from deep down. And the scripture says, no man has
anything except that which he has received from heaven, meaning there are things God deposits
into you. And then in another place, before King Agrippa, Paul testifies and says, I was
not disobedient to that heavenly vision, meaning there are things heavenly that God infuses into
you that you believe of yourself. And somehow, just like just finished saying, the things that
get you more than you get them, they get you, they arrest you, you try to walk away from them,
but you realize that's not me. They might even pay you a bit more. There's a, there's a, there's a
biggest, big kind of big shot in this town who, you know, guys at different companies where I would
do sales. Remember, I wasn't a salesman, but I just thought, I mean, we have this big platform. Why
don't we have the biggest telecoms and government departments advertising here? And so when I asked
in a meeting, I asked my manager, not in a condescending way, but of like, what can we do?
And she was like, uh, yeah, you know how you ask a question, you present a problem and then they
give it to you as a job. I say, so you go solve that. And so, uh, so my name goes around in those
spaces of like, there's a young man you need to watch. There's a young man at Spirit FM. He really
does this well. And so I remember, uh, so this gentleman calls me and this is, these are the words
he told me. So he mentioned an industry leader, two, three of them. He said, I so-and-so called me
and so-and-so called me and so-and-so called me and said that I should speak to you, uh, that you're
so good at selling and whatever and whatever. And then they said, they said, they said he would do
extremely well. The only problem is he has a small brand selling. Uh-huh. Now, I'm just waiting to hear
that, uh, the defunct Steadman report at that point. Yeah. Spirit FM got on all the Uganda,
All-Median product survey. Yeah. So we went nowhere. So this guy is, you know, like how you pitch to
someone and they're like, you got me. The only difference is that Steadman report, that Ipsos
report does not rank your station very highly, but I would give you the money. And so, so these guys,
you know, they would feel for you like, dude, you're good, but your cabrand is small. So we will
still go with WBS or whatever and whatever. So that would, for me, every failure, that failure
kept giving me, uh, stronger muscles of like, one day we'll break through, one day we'll break
through. So, so my name goes to this guy, highly recommended. He calls me up and says, come to my
office. You know, these offices, you walk in and, you know, from reception, you're intimidated,
you're looking around, but you're thinking, man, and radio stations are this big and our small room
somewhere in Mokono. Okay. You see you, man. And so he gives me a very fine deal to be precise.
He was tripling my salary. It was a private conversation, but now I can tell you tripling
my salary, looked at my small little white, super limited Toyota car and said, I'll give you a brand
new car. That's what I thought you had come in when I asked you.
I had taken along without seeing what you drive. I apologize. Okay.
3500cc. I like it. I like it. It talks to me while I talk to it. And so, uh, so he tells me I'll
trip your salary, give you a brand new car. And then when you come in here, you write your own,
modus operandi. If you want to fire everybody, if you want to, we will, we will format ourselves
around you and your talent. That's tempting. The other side, I had only the last thing. I
worked the way I worked. But everything else, I mean, no budgets, not much to talk over and whatever
all we had was, uh, he used to say, my CEO used to say, we're just on a wing and a prayer. You
know, like when you're flying in the middle of nowhere on low fuel, you're just on a wing and
a prayer and say, Lord, I hope we land. And so, uh, first meeting and you're tempted. Do you know
when your head is screaming? Yes, you need the money. But then after that scream, there's a loud
no spirit, a soft to know. A strong, soft, but strong. Yes. Something that holds you down to
the ground and said, not your thing. So I said, we'll meet again next week. So we met for three,
four straight weeks. And I had no headway. All he kept saying is, Oh, he had given me his clients,
his strategy of the business and everything, you know, given me all his clients, everything's like,
man, let's do this. Let's do this. You know, when you sleep uncomfortable about it,
you don't even sleep at all. Yeah, you don't know what it is. But now we spiritual people who are
taught right from time we're born again, listen to your heart, listen here, somewhere in your
belly. You can feel and you about it. It doesn't excitement about it. And usually what I tell people
when you have that kind of thing, just by time, by buying time, just use the same corporate
lingua of like, you know, I'm just finishing up a project right now. Give me about some four
weeks and have a clear mind. What you don't know what to do. You just say, give me time. I pray about
it. I feel and it wasn't even prayer as much as feeling like I want to, I want to sort out my
feelings down here, not in my head. My head is saying I need the money. But I'm thinking down
here, there's something so not nice. Long story short, I went to him and said, no,
you don't know what it means to any industry leader.
I was about to ask you how did that go and even after that, let me tell you how it, let me tell
you how it went there after to this day when we meet, I gritting me doesn't answer.
You're kidding me. How long ago was that? Maybe 14 years ago. That's usually blood. Men don't usually
hold on to things. I don't know. I don't know. I mean, and now he's politically connected. So
anytime like, hello, even if I tried it for you right on camera, if I called him, you wouldn't
pick my calls. Yeah. But you know, it used to hurt me. But after a while, I thought myself, hey,
he's not God. Like it's okay. It's okay. And so thereafter, of course, many other opportunities
opened up with Citizen TV Kenya. I did a consultancy for them from here when they were trying to
launch here. The project didn't go so well. And but that opened to me very many other things.
So this side, why, you know, so, so there's that inner vision for me. That's what I'm talking
about. It's here. Yeah. And anchor for your soul. You feel like I have a lot higher expectations of
myself than just being an employee somewhere doing, you know, just eight to five. I mean, we don't
work eight to five because when you're an owner, you work 24 seven. You know, yeah, I usually tell
I usually tell people that if money is your goal, you'll get it. Yes, you'll get it. But then
someone will pay you to change to change your vision. Yes, you understand. So your vision has
to be bigger than than any amount of money. Yeah. So how much are you worth and you're thinking?
I don't know. You'd pay me all the money you have and some Jesus Christ and what Jesus. Yes. Okay.
Okay. So I paid close attention to your history because most of you got you correct me. I noticed
this year Spirit FM won a number of awards this year. Okay. And you are like the queen of winning
awards. I've seen so you won. Was it how it's how it's women inspiring women inspiring. Okay.
That was a magnificent. Then I consider being in the newspapers 40 under 40 as an award of sorts.
Mm hmm. You might not consider it that but not everyone gets true gets there.
Engender has won an award. Right. Okay. Correct me. Yes. What's your word was that?
That was from South Africa. Women, the girls getting to the awards, very small awards.
Okay. The award is an award. Small awards in South Africa. Okay. So both of you and you know,
this is because what it shows me when you win an award, it says to me excellence. Yes. Okay.
It's a stump. It's a standard that you have set. Okay. Tell us about that. Now I'll start with you,
Josephine. Was it your target to make hallmark or to make a mark in your industry and what drives
your levels of excellence? The vision question that McLean did ask. The values have to come.
Okay. So and it's nothing that I passed to write down in the beginning and you know,
go this and that all I needed was. Okay. Yes. Vision, mission, which I did Polish years ago.
Something just when you do it and it is your own and you don't have to do the eight to five
becomes a 24 hours. I don't know how many times I have gone sleepless nights just out
making things happen on my own. Excellence. For me, the benchmark was done.
There is a time I just took off time in that book and I'm like, oh, okay. But again, being a person
that Josephine is anything that I touch, can it come out a certain way? It is what I want to
it to look like and I believe automatically it just comes out to that way. Last year we did,
by the way, add on our vision, know our values. Excellence as number one. Now that you bring
it out, it starts right away from the brand. You are talking about the world perceiving you a certain
way. For me, it was a reputation that I would like to create around this. Yes. And when you hear
just one person saying, that's good. You don't want to let that good hang in there. You want to
take it to the next level of better. Just keep going. And by the way, while you're doing this,
the noise is coming from all directions, hitting you, pulling you down scenarios that are actually
and for me, well, there is a way it hurts. But man, I choose for it to hurt, hurt so bad,
and then focus back onto that. So for me, excellence, if it is not, let us not even touch
it. So the book of Daniel did teach me the level of excellence that the Lord just manifested in
this human that is really, really, really spiritual. And it's something that I do not
want to let go. Still back to the good story. This year, January, I happened to have
shared testimony at the Tuesday fellowship. And while I was praying there, I was like,
God, what else? Because for me, that was like now there, just sharing with thousands. I'm like,
God, what else is there? It's something that happened to me when I was with the EU. And I'm
like, God, what else? Where else can I go to work in the world? Where is there? And I'm like, okay,
you win. And while I was thinking of the United Nations, the newspaper ad came through. And that's
how I applied and got there. So I asked God, what else I got? I have my, I have my, my, my,
oh, point of contact note that I carry to the grounds every day. And one of the things written
there was God confirmed that indeed it is from you. Let the work of the agenda, all the work that
I do be recognized. And that's how the word came up. Oh, wow. Within a few months. So now you,
this year, so I was checking it out. I said, you won a number of awards. Okay. I don't have them off
the tip of the fingers, but surely you do. Okay. You mind mentioning and then answering the question
in line with that. Almost all our shows on radio and TV, last year in December alone, we won
18 awards. In February, we won another seven. Every year, there's about 20 of them that come
through. And that's a testament of people who say, we like what you do. We rate them that highly.
They are the best on the market. And we still think, there's still a lot of room. I mean,
there's still a lot of mountains to conquer. And so one of the things we don't do is to
watch what you're doing in order for us to do. We think that's low. We think that's cheap.
Because we think, and we don't do that in a, in a prideful way. We just think that
there's no need to have two people doing the same thing. To me, that speaks to authenticity.
Yeah. And let me tell you, people will always gravitate towards authenticity.
People will, because all of us are unique. What are they looking for? We're looking for uniqueness.
We don't want a cheap copy of something fake. No, we want the original. Be original. You have a
bad accent. Just be original about it. Give us something good in yourself. Because guess what?
There's enough market for everyone of us to be profitable. That's how God created a system.
His systems have no luck. Every system God created and every space God will put us in,
there's enough provision to be profitable. Every business can be. So we don't watch other TVs to
say Spirit TV should be, they should do that show, should do that show. If anything, the bigger TVs
actually watch our shows and you find two weeks later, the same concept you put up two weeks ago
is on screen and you're thinking, that's good. That's good, but not original. The thing is ours.
This is it. Our cooking show is winning a word. We call it, this is it. This is it. This is Korea.
This is it. And so all cooking shows, for example, used to be, the chef goes to the cooking and then
tells you the ingredients and whatever. We used to do that with cook and dine. Exactly. And now for
us, our shows on cooking, it is a chef who hosts any one of you and we focus on the eating,
not on the cooking. Okay. And then all the big TV shows, they change their formats and now they,
and you're like, dude, now yours was doing well with the chef telling us what he's putting in
and mixing it. Please keep it that way. Now you change it to ours. You see, the market is interesting.
People are watching. You think people are stupid? Even poor people. They're not stupid, just that
they're poor. But they watch and say, the other guy does it better. You know why? Because it is
authentic. An authentic thing, just where you think the way you are. And I, it's really down to my
father. He instilled a discipline of don't try to copy what the other boy is doing. And you became
forsake. Why did you do it? Because the other one was also doing it. You'll get a bokeh for that.
Actually, you'd get off the hook if you can give a good reason why you decided to do this or say,
I thought this would be this and that would be that. Even if you failed, you gave a good
explanation. Like, okay, I like the way you think. So we're never under pressure to do certain things,
including our contracts. You asked me one time and said, how come you have long-serving staff? The
average number of years, our staff stay with us. Even young people is seven years. Some are 14 years,
some are 12, some are four. But, average, seven years. And usually, when another opportunity comes
up, we encourage our people, look for better opportunities. If you feel at one point you've
served your time, because yes, it's a business, but it's also ministry. Because there are times
God would have that you come here, learn everything that you can. And maybe we don't have anything
else to give you, or you have other places where you can go serve. And guess what? I negotiate
contracts for staff from here moving from us to other places for them. Because people call and say,
McLean works for you? Yeah. Oh, you need him on your team. But he won't come cheap. I pay him
quite a lot of money. If you triple it, I think I might just tell him to go. And people go like,
you would do that for me? But I'm leaving you. No, you're not leaving me. I don't own you.
God does. I wish you could speak about that even when it comes to ministries.
And you know, I can attest to what he's saying, because many years ago, about 15 years ago,
I happened to have wanted to pouch one of the presenters there, Spirit FM. Only to bring her
on board. And she kicked off with our gospel, gospel soul that we created. And she was really good
that the Shut Time magazine presented her in a way. And I'm like, she can actually do this. And
she came in handy. But again, she kept on Spirit FM. What an opportunity, a name ployak is able to.
It's a dream. You give them space to own their craft. So we tell them, you don't know,
you're really not working for me. CEO used to say the same thing. He'll drill it every week.
Old man could talk, but I love, I love talking, listening to people. So in essence, what you do
is actually you provide a platform for people to grow in their purpose. Thank you very much. In
other words, don't come here just for money. Like you said, that's too cheap. If all you want is
money, there will always be someone who'll pay you better. And you'll always have a problem
with my payment. However good it is, you'll find one reason to say it didn't come on time.
The 30,000 seedings it is always blah, blah, blah. Human beings don't get satisfied. Exactly.
So money is too low, a value to put on your craft, because it's divine. And so we tell the guy,
okay, here's the show. What do you want to do? I want to change this. I want to change this.
We brainstorm and guess what? Even the cleaner radio station and TV station is a producer,
because when we sit in those meetings, it's everybody. We brainstorm together and some of
our best ideas are from technicians who, you know, are behind the scenes cameras. Tell you,
the way you answer the phone, I don't know, somehow you sound disinterested. If only you could do
this, if only you could do this. And we've trained the professionals to listen in, go beyond the
shirt that guy is wearing. I mean, it's just like a cheap t-shirt, but there's something in him you
have to recognize the God factor. And you find that guy comes and says, I would like you to sound
a little bit happier. And you find that is the one thing that we needed to change. And from a
producer's view, you couldn't tell what it was until that guy tells you, I would like, how about
we added one more hour to that show. And that kicks the thing. And we keep telling ourselves,
we're on the radius, we're on the airtime, the equipment is ours. So we can do it whatever you
want. That ownership is important. Yes. Maki, go ahead. Yeah.
Anything that has to do with inspiring people, with uplifting people, with bettering people's
lives, I'm sold for that. Because for me, that's also the ministry, just to inspire people and
bring out the best in people, understand? And from what we're sharing now, I come to the point of
the authenticity to your vision, okay, is what people will buy into, that it doesn't matter
how much you offer them, they are not willing to push this aside for the instant gratification.
You understand? So for me, the question to you guys is, from the beat of understanding the power
that your visions have, and the people that have plugged into it, now they are hooked,
how are you guys using your vision of whatever you're doing? And this is also a question that
Rabbi was already bringing up to minister. And I'm not talking ministry in terms of
ministry opened the Bible and this is that and that and that, but ministry in terms of just
change. Yes, letting people's lights shine.
Thank you. If I even answer that, we are having a very big challenge currently,
and I believe we need to do beyond triple the work that we are doing. The generation today has a
bar they have set for themselves that is highly justified by what we have on the digital,
digital evolution. And now with AI coming into the picture, it is, oh my God, another level.
The things that we are talking about, while I listened into, you know, our cater, I'm like,
how is a man today able to even get to this kind of thing? And I've just been seeing so much,
it goes back still to the parents that I liars with on a single day because they
are millennial parents. They are parenting Gen Z's and the world is really, really, really,
really distorted. I want to first of all throw this back to Kate and then I'll come back and
answer the question. But that ponder just hit me. I'm just listening to what everybody is saying.
I believe we have so much to do where Snapchat or IG is not what is going to give you,
but there is much more ingrained into what the Lord has purpose to do.
And I think there's still a remnant because my understanding of your question is,
how do you recruit people into your vision? For us, what we do is we are an open book
that we are here, yes, we are business because we must be faithful with our resources,
meaning we can't spend more than we income or rather we should income more than we spend.
I like the second part. So if we need to spend a million shillings, how do we get two?
Instead of saying we spend two when we have one, if all at the end of the day, all we have is one,
we'll spend less than one so that you keep it at 200k for the rainy day. So we are as frugal,
as straight with money. To the point, sometimes we just walk to our clients and say,
I've been giving you this at X amount of money I cannot afford to. So you got to double this.
And then people will be like, oh, you guys are old. There was a time in our lives at the radio
station, we are completely broke. Was that recent? No, long time ago. And you know what?
And we're doing so much work because we're free because it's ministry. In fact, I wanted to ask,
in line with that, I wanted to ask which light shines brighter, is it that of ministry or that
of business? Which leads the cut? Ministry. So ministry leads the cut, then business follows.
Because the ministry is the eternal. It never changes. How I do it changes.
But the ministry must always be. So if, for example, out of the two, if push comes to show,
which sometimes it does, and you sacrifice one thing, it will be the money. So we have carried
some preachers for next to free. For the sake of ministry. Yes. The bit of free. The Lord one
time, so I was telling you, we're broken. We're doing so much work. We're doing well. The audience
liked us. And everything was like, but we're struggling every month, month to month. And you
know, and then so we took time to pray and fast. What's that thing we need to do? And I'll never
forget. God is humorous. He said, stop giving free stuff. I like, huh? Stop giving free stuff.
So I shared with teammates and said, so moving forward, no more free stuff. And then guess what?
The hard part came. I have been carrying you for three years, man, a guy full of the annoying and
a part of the ghost. Now I got to tell you what you've been getting for free. Got to cost you some
money. And so some guys took offense. How is the reaction? Some people took offense and said,
now you're also just money minded. It's about the money. You guys are losing it. Actually,
you're going to collapse. The Lord has lifted from this place because I'm off. And you're thinking,
wow. For me, it gave me an opportunity to see some people that we thought were our friends.
I'm like, dude, which part of me, having worked with me for 10 years, 15 years,
would get you to think like that? And you're like, wow. You know the pain it causes? You get
disappointed. Not even disappointed. I'm like, really, really? And I've given you free air time
for a long. And you have the desire to think. I'm just anyway. So then some people graciously
were like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I need credit budget. Oh, but you know. So a lot of people
just fell off. And you're like, it's okay. And then go like, nah, I can't because like, it's okay.
The church committee means committee have to say, okay. And but you need to painful thing
because you know, give us and don't be in a hurry. Give it your three years.
And then guys, it's like when one guy walks out in protest, God brings
a very unassuming and says, God wants me on this platform. Right now I don't have the money. Oh,
I don't have the money you're looking for. But soon I'll have the money. A gentleman just called
and said, I mean this, it was a small church. And he said, God told me to be on your radio.
Right now, I don't have the money you want, but you take my small money. Give me like two years.
I'll be one of your best clients. Do you know, I hear those statements almost every week.
So sometimes you, you generally need a bit of discernment to know whether it is good or a guy's
fresh. But you know, there's a genuineness. That is why even in this, you have to stay spiritual.
Correct. True. Because you need the discernment. How do you throw off? Would you put up? Would you
support an hood? So we're like, let's take a holy gamble on him. And I can tell you in 18 months,
guy moved to the top 10 of our clients, top 10. And he pays way up from beyond the contract.
And we're like, whoa. So I can tell you hundreds of stories like that, including people mysteriously
walking to the station and paying off people's bills, pastors bills, ministries bills. And
someone just walks in and says, uh, pastor Josephine. Sometimes they don't even know the name.
They say, there's a lady, uh, at about, uh, 10 PM on Tuesdays. Well, I don't even know her name.
That lady there, how much is, how much does she pay? So you should, you know, they bring these
people to me because I mean, there's nondisclosure stuff. So, you know, I was like, no, no, no,
you tell me. So one guy calls and says, actually walks in and says, I want to know how much
he pays. I go like, dude, that's private information. And you know, it was a tag for about
four, five minutes, spoke to me and said, tell him. So I tell the guy it was, um, I think 36 million.
And so for the year, no, no, no, no, no, his balance then. Okay. Yeah. Okay. So I tell him 36 million.
And then, um, uh, he had come with a friend and they were very unassuming guys in sandals
with a kashat. So he gets his chivera here and begins getting a bundle of money on the table.
One, two, three, four. So I'm watching this on the table and my brain is beginning to think,
could this be fake money? I don't know. You know, when you profess something that happens
and you begin thinking, maybe it's not true. I like the honesty one. Yeah. Because you pray
for rain, but you don't carry an umbrella. And so I was like, you know, so the guy counts and then
goes through it again with this one. He's like, you can, that one, that one. So clearly he had more
money than that. So he puts it and then puts the balance here. And then so I call him, you know,
the cashier and said, you know, he's paying for this clients thing. And then so we ask him,
so the lady asks him, so sir, what name? He said, no, that's not important. We're like,
yeah, but the receipt needs to be in someone's name who has paid. And he's like, no, no, don't
worry. I was like, okay, is it the pastor who sent you? He said, no, no, no, he didn't send me.
And so how do we write him? He said, you write his name or the minutes to the church and I don't
know his other name. You just write his name. So he does. And then he walks out, true story.
He walks out five minutes later, he comes by manager, sorry, sorry to disturb your day.
Then there's this other pastor at midnight. They are normally praying. They're normally praying.
The husband and wife, what's the name? And I'm like, what day? Because I know my program line
line, the back of my hand, say that should be so I say that that's the name. What is their balance?
Give me a minute. I go check. It was about the same.
And he pays the whole bill. And then, and then, then, so while, you know, bring his receipt,
I mean, we're just seated. I still don't know how this is playing out. My head, I'm thinking,
I've never seen anything like this. And then he says, so no, I asked him, so what do I tell the
pastor? Like who paid or whatever. I like give me something to say. And then he tells, he says,
tell him to stop raising, wasting time raising money. Let him do ministry. He goes. And then,
and then he said, I'll be back next. And he did, he returned. I'm talking about COVID time.
Okay. So now the biggest story is even now communicating that to these ministers.
They thought we were joking. We're playing a prank. They are like, you know, you radio people,
you TV people can be funny. You people, you are funny. You crack a lot of jokes.
Cool. I said, dude, your bill is cleared to zero. And even some days some cabalance,
which had gone on. That encourages me for, you know,
and then the guy says, so the pastor, he goes like, he first actually hung up. He said,
what? My bill is paid fully. What? I'll call you back. We call again. And then he says,
he said, you know, you really like joking, joking. But, but you know, I'm looking for your money.
I'm actually working very hard. We're trying to raise the money. We said, no, no, no, what we're
saying is the bill is paid, you know, and guy goes like, what do you mean? So to even, we just told
him, okay, do you know what you do? Just come over and get your receipt. So he comes and says,
I will not believe Thomas story until I see the receipt, the receipt showing zero balance.
He looks at his wife and says, honey, do you remember two weeks ago when we were praying?
You received a word. She even got her thing here wrote two weeks ago. The Lord told them,
don't worry about the bill. I will clear it. So it, as in, I have seen those miracles.
Now you understand why he really needed to answer this question.
Miracles still happen. And we love hearing such stories because in today's world, it's actually
the opposite. People actually pay to get those programs off the platforms, but to hear that
the actually people out there who are still listening to God to be kingdom finances that
you would actually pay. You don't even want to be recognized. You understand you're behind the
scenes and you're comfortable with that because you've understood your role also
in this whole mission. You know that he holds the vision. He's pushing forward with it. My job
is to be a destiny helper, jumping with him and helping push. That's why, for example, I love
paying my tithe on time. And I no longer just pay tithe end of month because I have different
streams of income. So sometimes, you know, you do a cut deal for somebody and they send you 200k,
I pay it on momo pay. The church has a momo pay, has an account, you transfer. You know why?
Because I don't want to sit on God's money because that ministry, first of all, is spiritual,
but naturally they have responsibilities. And I believe that tithe is not a financial
transaction. It is a spiritual transaction. So many people don't understand it. It is a spiritual
transaction. Why do you wait to do to today what you can actually do? Rather, why do you
wait to do something tomorrow what you can actually do today? Get God's money out. Actually,
for me in principle, out of honor, I try my best to first give God his money before I spend any
money. His is the first, because when he says the first born is mine, the first fruit is mine,
that which opens the womb. He means literally the first expenditure should be God's money.
You may not take it to church now or give it to the minister now, but first separate it
and say this is God's money. So at my house or in my drawer at office, there's a drawer that
if you find any money there, 99.99999% recurring, it is God's money. So even on the broguest day,
well, I never have broguest days. So even an example, so if you looked at that, it would
definitely be God's money. And talking of even never broke, it's not like, oh, because I sue me
in money because no, no, no, no, I live by faith. I live off, I live off God, meaning that even if
I walked out of the house with that 5k, that has no bearing on what I'll be able to do that day.
Any challenge that comes, anything that needs a million, anything that needs a hundred million,
I'll raise it. How? I don't know. What about you, Josephine, when it comes to like,
okay, so you want to answer the question first, but along with, I want you to, what about the area
of money for you? Because we're all in different kinds of ministry, okay? I'm a pulpit minister,
you're doing ministry in terms of mentoring young ladies and other things and yours is
broadcasting, you're evangelizing through broadcasting. Money, the Bible says it answers all
things. Yeah, true. Okay. And some people can't seem to understand that things are not done by magic.
God doesn't use magic, okay? God uses principles, spiritual principles. How would you meet the
challenges financially concerning the visions and the goals you want to achieve?
Perhaps even an ad lib regarding a tithe. This will be our second year of having audited financial
accounts as an organization, very, very young. The first year we spent a holder with this accountant
who is Christian, but could not appreciate that there was this car expense, which was
tithe. And there was a little bit more of tithes as well. This year, it has been a bit more.
Going back to finances, for us, we set it in the beginning because, well, we have a rural
version of engender girls, where we do the mentorship for the girls in Mayuga and Iganga,
and that is purely pro bono. Out of the proceeds that comes from the urban chapter of engender girls
ends up in the other, and we do the different outreaches there because the other one focuses
purely on menstruation, menstrual hygiene management, because as a result of COVID,
we are having thousands of girls statistics, Kamuli Igangamayuga, the highest in the country,
who have gotten teenage pregnancies as a result of staying at home, and not being able to manage
menstrual hygiene. Well, long story short, I remember when we kicked off, we had 17 girls as
engender girls going out to camp. At that point, I wasn't even thinking of what else are we going
to do as engender. For now, it was resilience camp. There were 17 girls, 10 were paid for, the seven
for us were like a seed. The last camp we had the resilience one, it was 153 girls,
so the year just kept going. The general manager now knows that whatever drops in
first in terms of payment, straight away goes. That one I don't even ask, but on top of that,
we call, well, we will call them the pro bono, but we will take on certain girls as part to just get
those things moving. It goes back to the principle. In the craft, that principle has to flow,
and it has to push the frequency to get to a particular level in terms of it is something
that I am still learning, but appreciating at the same time. Any small activity we get to do,
many of our activities, by the way, happen during holidays with the girls, and the parents are not
sure what are we doing with the girls, so we create things right there, and we are actually
working simply because the principles. The three principles we use, chief mentor is God,
that is top most. Amidst everything happening in the evolution of the world, the, oh, I don't even
want to say the word because somebody will, we will mentor best on the principles of
Africanism, the African culture. Then the empiricism, which is not the scientific aspect,
but best on our own observation and research methods that we have been able to see that
will create impact. So any activity we do, we will have to be as a team of volunteers and the
full-time staff. We have to be there at least 30 minutes in advance, and we dedicate half of the
30 minutes time to God, pushing everything to God to just take over. Many parents keep asking,
what did we do to get this girl who does this in a certain way to now become like this? I literally
don't. And I keep looking at others and I'm like, guys, what did we do? And they try to justify,
but the reality is God takes precedence in that area. How many girls do you have now?
As per the impact assessment that I'm trying to put together to give the monitoring and evaluation
person to do, we are talking about 4,000 girls. 4,000 from 17? Yes, and the big numbers are coming
from the rural, whom we get to do literally, oh my God, crowds, but we get to count every single girl.
For the urban chapter, they are 1,600 girls. They all don't show up at once, some keep going, and then
as they grow, because we have to have that level of innovativeness and are moving towards that.
And this is in two years? Two, three years? No, we will be four years. Four years now.
Okay. So much to learn from. Do you count COVID? You don't count COVID? Yes, we do count COVID.
Because was the program going on during COVID? It did, and in a minimal way. Okay. That's how
we picked a few girls. We went to the mechanics deep in some area for them to, there were very few,
but we had to do something. Okay. Maki? Yeah, specifically to engender and the NGO,
and I know I'm asking this in terms of NGO. Have you guys have situations, or if you had,
I would just love to hear that. I'm sure someone else would love to hear that. Have you had cases
where there are third hands and seen hands trying to put something on the table so you can,
you know, forward a certain kind of agenda to this generation, which is not your vision,
and which is not what you hooked on to. Very interesting. Two occurrences have happened,
and that's a point where now the spirit doesn't even whisper, but shouts and says your soul is
being sold by a kabawele of soup. Like, literally. I like that analogy. That's exactly how it has come
through. He has been talking about the miracles of, you know, all the payments cleared, and for me,
those are moments I touch God. I feel like I am touching, and however small it has been for me,
I keep seeing it happen. I recall, hmm, we were doing our first P7 leavers transition camp. The girls
are going to be home. P7 is done. It's all distorted. There are many numbers. There have been P71
and two in particular schools, and this particular came also in the name of being a Christian NGO,
and they were signing on 30 girls, and they filled in the forms everything happened. But before they
remitted the money they sold to me, that was the end of it, because we cannot be party to, you know,
to the other gender that is not of God, and you know that. Yes, yes. And one of the things that
had caught me, because they first spoke in the went round circles, but when they came to the point
of, we shall also want to leverage on the existing girls to be able to, some like clarify,
that's when now he, let's stop using big words, and we are like, okay, thank you very much. It has
been a pleasure. Meanwhile, I thought we had numbers that day. It was painful, but I was
very, very happy. I shared with the general manager, and she was more proud to even just,
just to be a part of the thing that Katie talked about, people just keep working without even
thinking about the money aspect. It comes off handy. There is one though, where parents,
no, but this one was the other way around. A girl has been just out of school, and they are literally
lesbian. And I still don't know what to do. Because she failed her level. She's back into her level.
And because of the circumstances, the parents have actually allowed her to date openly,
just to effect what we started to take shape. So that is a transition. Many more, I have been praying
for a particular kind of funding to come to us. We don't have any funding yet.
And any funding that has these strings, I'm able to see it because this side of the world,
where I am, it is very clear. They even ask us to create, oh my God, what is it? We need a
statement on your stand on this. By the way, the world, the development world is in huge anxiety
in terms of funding because of the agenda that is pushing us. It's a diversity
close. I have been praying and God, I believe I'll be back here to just say it happened.
Has your company experienced something that sort of? For us, we're gossips,
and the business, so it becomes very hard. And you see, oh, we don't just own Spirit FM,
we own another radio, which is secular. By secular, I don't mean evil. Yeah, I just mean
it's secular. Yeah, secular. We don't front Jesus in the street in your face. It's just like,
you know, you like nice country music. Boba FM will play you nice country music. I love Boba
FM. I used to listen to that station. Come on, man. It was actually your idea, 2007, was it?
2008. Yes. And so that one, we just wanted to, we had had huge success with this one. We wanted
to try out something and say, how would that feel? So the good thing is with Spirit FM and Spirit TV,
it's right in your face. Jesus all over the place. You would be mad to even, you know, it's like,
you know, she's a woman and you were telling her the thing you should be telling a man like,
you know, so that bit, I think, has helped us. But even then, we have a strict editorial policy
of things that you can and cannot say on our radio. So TV is, even if you're a paid up client,
and we have a team, one of the best legal teams in this town, will throw you out even when, you
know, if you break some of those things. And some of the things are not necessarily very,
like, evil, evil, evil. One of them is as simple as just on each other as ministers.
The values. Yeah. So you can't come on our platform and bash another preacher,
even if he's wrong and you're right. So we make that very clear. We put it in writing,
meaning I don't want to aid a conversation that I don't be a part of. Listen, I have,
I am being obedient to the heavenly vision. That time is short. People are going to hell. People's
souls are in, you know, in Katiawaga, you know, I don't have time to argue about the length of your
suits and the color of your hair. You're almost inspiring me to get to radio. Seriously, I don't
have time to do that. So seriously, we don't broadcast. We narrowcast. Meaning that you
so know what agenda we're on. We keep telling our team, but we also have an agenda. We actually
have an agenda. It's not the other guys. Other guys are coping from us. We have an agenda,
and it's a Jesus agenda, and we're so passionate about it. We're so out there. So there's time we
take in the week that every staff member knows it's time for prayer, reading the word, however
boring it might be. All of us from sea or to, you're there. Say, if you're even sleeping,
you sleep here. It's in the bedroom. You sleep after we say, man, you can get up, go and get
your camera. Why? Because we're on an agenda. So some people, by the way, come to us, all they have
is talent and a Christian name. But four years later, they go like, whether I like here or no,
you people, I tell you, don't just pray, pray. You pray for real. I said, yes,
guys, we need to raise $75 million by 5pm today. Guys, come, we pray.
By the way, that, those miracles I was telling you about, when the team watched all that because
we're open and we told them, guys said, man, it's changed my life and my faith. Come on. I said,
realizing that God has our needs in mind and money will come. Guys, guys are like, we said,
working in new dimensions of finances, because we realized you can be here,
and God has your miracle. So why do you give up? So it's like when you witness a miracle,
your life changes. Okay. How much time do you have? Less than, less than seven minutes. Less than
seven minutes. Okay. We just started. I told you. It's always happens. We've done one hour.
One hour and 25 minutes. Okay. Okay. So, gosh, there's so many things that would have loved us
to touch, but let me see if we could summarize the answers. What, where do you derive your
inspiration? Are there books that you've read that have played a vital role in making you who you
are? Both of you, I'd love to hear, who do you read? Are you readers or who do you listen to?
Who do you, especially from the past, voices that have played a role for where your path is now?
I've read books. I read books. I still read books. I have a book that I'm starting to read right in
there. At the end of the day, the inspiration has to come from that. All right. So the Bible is there.
It has to be. I even swifted, I drifted off. I read weird books, even from Maya Maski's mother.
A woman makes a plan. Since when must we? Yes, we plan. But anyway, I find that at the end of the
day, what works for me, I think, what doesn't work, it still goes back there. And the Spirit will
clearly tell you. Okay. What about you? Oh, I love reading. I now, I read a little less than I would
want to, because of time and running here and there. But I do a lot of listening and watching.
And the world is full of good content. Huge. You just need to have your compass in here.
It's like when you have something here, a bit of it, like there's an energy that pulls it to you.
You realize that actually stuff is there. So YouTube, ask people. People send me ebooks.
You find a guy like Bishop Doug, for his 60th birthday a few weeks ago, gave out 60 books for
free. So we're just, you know, someone visited me and was talking about it. And I'm like, huh?
And he's like, yeah, I can actually send you the link. I go 60 books that will take you a whole
year to read. So let me see. Every season in my heart, I just feel pulled to a particular
minister, a particular someone, a Jim Rohn, T. L. Osborne, in all robots, a Kenneth Hagin,
a Kenneth Copland. Now I'm binging on Jesse DuBland is my man, you know, with his bad black accent.
There's a lot of similarity between you two. He says, he says, I'm white, but I preach black.
Okay. Okay. Okay. What about, Maki, you said, you have a question? No, you don't.
What about us? This is the last question. And then we close it off.
What would you say to someone out there who has struggled to find their call and purpose,
struggled to kick off, and they don't know where to start and what to do, speak a word to them?
Sorry, let me just add to that. So you'll answer it all at once. On top of that,
if they're in a dilemma of so many things, they feel they're good at, but how do I pin
point that this is the thing and this one thing will help to push these others?
It, two things. Sometimes it is as simple as that. Sometimes it is a maze of walking by faith.
Okay. And therefore, like the scripture says, do whatever your hand findeth to do.
And while I did, do it very well, including washing your car. My father's car is,
you dust, I would dust them in shoes. I would spend 40 minutes just shining one shoe
until you can see your own reflection on the shoe. You look at it and you go like,
so there's, there's nothing in my entire life that I can't do. If you want me to be your driver,
Rabbi, please give me the job. I love driving. I would do it very well. And while at it,
I'll keep that car neat, clean, fueled and scratched. So there's nothing I can't do.
So people who work for me, this is nothing I cannot do. Remember, I started here as a volunteer
who just comes to put my fader up, fader down for somebody like that. So by default,
you in studio caught up with all these men of God for like 18 hours. So you, you have any
information overload, but you, you take it as I want to help you. And in that process, you know,
guys get, so one, the simplest things I can say is pray. As in by prayer, I don't mean just blabbering,
make up your mind. What do you want to go to do? It's like, it's like targeted prayer.
Yeah. And pray, pray in the simplest terms. Imagine you're in trouble. Out on the ocean,
midnight, you don't know what to do. You're not going to pray blah, blah, blah prayers. You're going
to say, God, I don't know where I am. Help me. And I can promise you as well as I know my name
is Cater. God will answer you in very certain terms, very clear terms. Okay. So pray. Yeah. So
pray. Number two, be out on the look for answers. Okay. Some of them will be very plain and simple.
Some will be complex, like someone just giving you an idea, which leads to another idea, which
leads to a person, which leads to so be be on the lookout for is this, this is this is like
when you pray for your wife, every girl who says hi is potentially the answer. So you have to,
your heart, it's a disposition of the heart that you be on the lookout. But number three,
be excellent. Yes. That's a very vital one. Be excellent. And number four, work by faith,
meaning don't fear to miss it. Don't fear. Try it out. Like we say at our radio station, we
own the radio, we own the equipment, we own our lives. If we miss it, we'll say,
God, that one didn't work and have a big enough ego to accept to fail. So there are shows we shoot.
At the end, we look at the project, we say, that one we trash. But guess what? Out of 10,
the hit rate with the time will become 9.9. But have enough big ego to say, I can't be wrong.
Okay. What about you, Josie? Humility, just to be humble. However, how you go, come back down.
There is nothing impossible. Okay, to unload it to that. So take the risk. I like the scripture of
and to God, who is able to keep you from falling and will even present you faultless.
To himself. Just take the risk. Rabbi, the last time we met, I was doing something else in the
currently I'm in charge of the innovations and knowledge management. It was a risk and I'm
already getting the praises flowing. So the risk, it always pays off. God in everything,
you're good to go. That can fail. Wow. This is the one podcast in which I've said the least.
Okay. Keita Anguzu and Josephine Omunide. Thank you so much. We have to host you guys again.
To my co-host Afimani, MoneyBugs McLean. Thank you so much. And God bless you. I hope the conversation
was worth it. I'll see you next time.